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The pension fund claims me 8200 euros of overpayment

retired for 12 years, She comes to learn that his pension will be reduced and that it must repay a debt. When she recalls the letter that she received from his

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The pension fund claims me 8200 euros of overpayment

retired for 12 years, She comes to learn that his pension will be reduced and that it must repay a debt.

When she recalls the letter that she received from his pension fund, Mireille has a voice that trembles. On the 24th of December last, Carsat (caisse retirement insurance and occupational health) of the Loiret him indicates that an error has crept in the amount of his pension. For this former employee of bank of 72 years, this is the double punishment : she learns both that she has two months for them to settle an overpayment of 8203 euros, but also that his retirement will melt to 1591 € to 1253 € per month.

More than a month later, she is still in shock. "They tell me that there was an error amount over the period 1 December 2016 to 30 November 2018, but I don't understand why. This is not me, who have calculated the pension that I paid. It seems to me absurd." Mireille moved to Carsat to see more clearly, "but I was in all my statements, I understood nothing".

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"I don't have a lot of means, and more importantly, when I stopped working, I did a loan for me to buy the small three-room apartment in which I live. The bank would have lent as much with 338 euros less each month?" It is his concern, this loan that it must repay more than € 800 per month for a little over seven years. While paying her condominium fees and the expensive work of restoration on the horizon.

of Course, it also receives a supplementary retirement pension and a survivor of her husband who died in November 2000, 894 euros in total. But "338 euros per month in the least, it is huge! breath does it. Since then, she has written to the president of the fund and referred to the committee of amicable recourse.

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reversion may change over the years

What happened ? "The amount paid each month by Carsat includes the basic pension of Mireille, but also the reversion of her husband. It is this last which has been revised downward, explains the Cnav (national Fund for old-age insurance) (1). A priori, because its resources have changed since the original study of his record."

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an amount equal to 54% of the pension that would have affected the deceased spouse, the reversionary pension paid by the basic plan has its own characteristics. In contrast to that paid by supplementary schemes, it is subject to a ceiling of resources : for a single person, it is set at 20 862 euros in 2019 (2080 X gross hourly minimum wage) to perceive it. What is it? Wages and salaries for the employees, the professional income of non-wage for self-employed workers, unemployment benefits or retirement income from real estate, but also retirement pensions and supplementary pensions, survivors ' pensions paid by other plans.

It is these last that would have changed the situation to Mireille. "It is not an error per se," explains Monika Tran, a lawyer in the Cnav. The calculation is good, but we had a late knowledge of the payment of his supplementary pension."

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We often forget that "the reversion of the basic plan is not definitively acquired. It may be revised by the pension fund to two times, says Dominique Prévert : when you reach the legal age of retirement (62 years), but especially when you liquidate your pension. At this time, the right to the reversion that you had been granted may be challenged, but you can also acquire it permanently, regardless of the resources later." In the case of Mireille, this calculation has been done, it seems, on foundations that are false.

Show his / her repayment difficulties

The pension funds may apply a maximum reimbursement for two years of overpayment as a result of errors of the folder, even if they are of them. But be careful, "in the case of fraud, we may request up to 20 years of a recall," says the legal department of the Cnav.

For people of good faith, this debt can be erased, if the resources of the insured are less than the ceiling set to receive the solidarity allowance for the elderly (Aspa), (868,20 euros per month). Otherwise, the pensioner may apply for a remission of debt and a staggering.

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"Mireille, can ask for further explanations to the commission of amicable recourse, advises Christine Cambus, legal director of the Cnav. We should then give the calculation methods with details on the resources taken into account so that it verifies the data. It can also apply for a remission of a debt. If it does not get full, we will issue a payment schedule. It is not necessary that it is censorship. It must present all of its expenses and show its potential repayment difficulties."

Mireille is it an isolated case ? "Many pensioners are victims of the same adjustments and do not understand it," says Dominique Prévert. It's no wonder. The request for reversion is complex on the back - the rules of the game are multiple, they may vary according to the schemes - and on the form - the questionnaire administration is incomprehensible !"

"Psychologically, this is unbearable, rants and raves Mireille. Now, I'm suspicious. The error is human, but still! This means that they can also err in the other direction: how many people do not touch everything that they should touch it ?" The question may arise.

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(1) The Cnav manages the basic pension of private sector employees, self-employed workers, contract of the public service and artists authors. National fund, it ensures the coordination of its network of regional funds (Carsat in the hexagon, CGSS in overseas departments and CSS, Mayotte) which are in charge of the pension files of the insured persons on the whole territory. In the Ile-de-France, it is the Cnav, which is in charge of the dossiers.

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